finally found it although I am not 100% sure what it was
F12 in IE allows you to go into the developer mode. I was able to see that it had some sort of phantom top padding by 30px. Although that was no where in the code whatsoever. Not css, index, nothing. I removed a css reference for a css that is not on the server (left by another project) and badabing the padding was gone.
man I hate it when it does that....
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