General Discussions

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-08-2006, 11:39 PM

He needs to be removed from power. Too bad China is buddy buddy with them. Got to love it.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,218699,00.html

**ltn1dr** · 10-09-2006, 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaStangGuy

He needs to be removed from power. Too bad China is buddy buddy with them. Got to love it.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,218699,00.html

Ohhh, they had the nerve huh?

**GeorgeB** · 10-09-2006, 10:55 AM

Yeah we invaded Iraq be cause we thought they "might" do what N. Korea IS DOING right now.

Kind of ironic huh?

**Bryan Le** · 10-09-2006, 11:26 AM

North Korea is a lot more powerful then Iraq with much more powerful allies...it's probably best we didn't/don't invade NK for a while...

I wouldn't be suprised if the president of NK some how ends up getting assassinated...by a secret covert operations team from the US.

Then in 5 years, we'll see plenty of movies about it.

**ltn1dr** · 10-09-2006, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan Le

North Korea is a lot more powerful then Iraq with much more powerful allies...it's probably best we didn't/don't invade NK for a while...

I wouldn't be suprised if the president of NK some how ends up getting assassinated...by a secret covert operations team from the US.

Then in 5 years, we'll see plenty of movies about it.

That's what I think we should have done with Sadaam

**GeorgeB** · 10-09-2006, 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan Le

North Korea is a lot more powerful then Iraq with much more powerful allies...it's probably best we didn't/don't invade NK for a while...

I wouldn't be suprised if the president of NK some how ends up getting assassinated...by a secret covert operations team from the US.

Then in 5 years, we'll see plenty of movies about it.

Wasn't saying we SHOULD invade N Korea. I was just pointing out that we sure had a lot of balls when it was a country and a particular dictator we wanted ousted. See then the threat of a rogue nation with nuclear weapons was a GREAT excuse to invade a sovereign nation, overthrow their government, and install one like our own..

Had China invaded Iraq and installed a communist state we'd be up in arms..

Now N Korea who happens to be well known for financing themselves with arms deals has developed a nuclear weapon and used our own news media to demonstrate to Osama and all the terrorists that "see we have one and it works! What's your bid?".

So my point was that the evidence is right here in front of us every day. We invaded Iraq for nothing while the real terrorist nations Iran and N Korea develop nuclear capabilities and now we can't do a darn thing about it.... Who's being truly held accountable for that screw up? No one...

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-09-2006, 02:19 PM

We invaded Iraq in March 2003 to prevent the very thing that the North Koreans were in the process of doing and almost done with. We did not know for sure if the North Koreans had successfully created a bomb yet but we knew there was a decent chance they did. It's much less of a risk to take out a country before they have Nuclear Weapons than it is to go into a country that already has them.

Who is being held accountable for North Korea? Certainly alot of the lies on Bill Clintons hands as North Korea started their secret nuclear program in the mid 90's even though they had an agreement to not do so with the US.

I guess that's what we get for trying diplomacy huh? It worked just fine didn't it?

**GeorgeB** · 10-09-2006, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaStangGuy

We invaded Iraq in March 2003 to prevent the very thing that the North Koreans were in the process of doing and almost done with. We did not know for sure if the North Koreans had successfully created a bomb yet but we knew there was a decent chance they did. It's much less of a risk to take out a country before they have Nuclear Weapons than it is to go into a country that already has them.

Yeah I hear you on it being more difficult now and for teh 2nd time I'm not saying invade Korea now, just pointing out the irony in what you just said. I mean your logic is saying "hey look over there, there's "a decent chance" N Koreans are "almost done with" creating a nuclear weapon.... bah... let's invade Iraq!"

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaStangGuy

Who is being held accountable for North Korea? Certainly alot of the lies on Bill Clintons hands as North Korea started their secret nuclear program in the mid 90's even though they had an agreement to not do so with the US.

I guess that's what we get for trying diplomacy huh? It worked just fine didn't it?

So the answer to who is being held responsible for this mess we're in now is who is being held responsible for Korea? In other words... change the subject.... :yes:

So diplomacy wasn't the answer then. But it is now? Pointing out mistakes made in teh Clinton administration won't help us now. In fact it casts a glaring spotlight on the fact that the Bush administration is here now and they still aren't doing anything about it.

Again I'm just pointing out the irony

Which nuclear program in Iraq did we stop again?

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-09-2006, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgeB

Yeah I hear you on it being more difficult now and for teh 2nd time I'm not saying invade Korea now, just pointing out the irony in what you just said. I mean your logic is saying "hey look over there, there's "a decent chance" N Koreans are "almost done with" creating a nuclear weapon.... bah... let's invade Iraq!"

No its more like Iraq defies the world 18 times over 11 years and no one does anything about it until the US steps up.

Quote:

So the answer to who is being held responsible for this mess we're in now is who is being held responsible for Korea? In other words... change the subject.... :yes:

No the subject is still North Korea possesing Nuclear Weapons. People are so quick to blame Bush yet Bush is the one that caught North Korea's secret Nuclear program. Clinton made a deal with North Korea in 1994, the Agreed Framework, that North Korea would not become a nuclear armed nation yet they went unchecked until 2001. You do the math. That's 6 years of them going undetected behind Clinton.

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So diplomacy wasn't the answer then. But it is now? Pointing out mistakes made in teh Clinton administration won't help us now.

Yes it will. You learn from History. Diplomacy failed and now has left the world with a Nuclear armed North Korea. Most of the fault lies in the UN and allowing China to prolong this for over a year and make no progress at all.

Quote:

In fact it casts a glaring spotlight on the fact that the Bush administration is here now and they still aren't doing anything about it.

I'm sorry but I can't help but laugh at that irony. Bush is the one that exposed the Nuclear Program in the first place. US intelligence. Not China intelligence. Not Japan intelligence. Not Britian. The US. The US then went to the security council. Not Japan. Not China. Not Britian. They then drafted a resolution calling for North Korea to halt their Nuclear Program. What initiative did the rest of the countries take? None. They followed America. Then what happens? China, with their veto power, stalls any progress in the United Nations and prolongs this for a year. No talks every happen and now North Korea has tested a nuclear weapon.

Yet it's all Bush's fault cause he is suppose to save the world. Yet everyone cries that America is acting like the world police when the do do something.

Quote:

Again I'm just pointing out the irony

Which nuclear program in Iraq did we stop again?

That's the point. It was never started. It has been documented that Sadaam Hussein wanted a Nuclear Iraq. Whether or not he had a program started is beside the point. He doesn't now and never will. No thanks to the United Nations either. If someone as unstable as Sadaam is a leader of a country in the Middle East, filled with terrorists and anti american governments, expresses interest in a Nuclear Program... especially after using WOMD in the past, then something needs to be done about it.

The Iraq war has been mismanaged and mistakes have been made. That does not negate the fact that the United States is the only one that stepped up and decided to do something about an unstable Iraq that had defied the world for 11 years. Did you ever think that if the rest of the world had provided more support that we would not see the struggles we see now?

**D.J.** · 10-10-2006, 12:05 PM

Oh, just to make a constructive post - as I see, at least what I have read from you, you don´t have any real clue what´s happening in the world. Your government is sure doing a great job brainwashing the "little man" ... Keep it up.

**MonkeyBiz** · 10-10-2006, 01:07 PM

I am a conservative and I think the war on iraq has gone on way too long and I have yet to see any benefits that affect ME personaly. A big waste of money and human lives.

Gas prices have gone up. Oil prices have gone up. 2000+ troops dead+ many more injured. i don;t care about Iraqis having freedoms. I care about my freedoms. I don;t care about rebuilding Iraq. Saddam, as big of a ******** as he is, kept the Sunni/Shiite muslims in line.

There are plenty of people HERE in AMerica that need aid and jobs. Instead of watching out troops get blown up by roadside bombs why not put them on the border to keep the illegals from entering and to bolster national security?

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-10-2006, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D.J.

Oh, just to make a constructive post - as I see, at least what I have read from you, you don´t have any real clue what´s happening in the world. Your government is sure doing a great job brainwashing the "little man" ... Keep it up.

That's not constructive. You offer nothing but attacks and insults to Americans. No one is going to take you seriously by spouting off your conspiracy theories of being brainwashed. What have I said that shows I know nothing that goes on in the world?

I am sure you have completely unbiased reliable news sources in Slovenia... right.....

**Libertate** · 10-10-2006, 04:04 PM

If I was the U.S. Gov., I would tell China in the UN " ok buddy, you are the big guy in the region - rain your puppy in, because tomorrow she will poop on everyone's lawn"...

**D.J.** · 10-10-2006, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaStangGuy

You offer nothing but attacks and insults to Americans.

Oh, really? Well, you´re insulting me with your comments.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BamaStangGuy

I am sure you have completely unbiased reliable news sources in Slovenia... right.....

Believe me, much more reliable than you

We´re not involved in this things directly so we (our media) can be more objetive.

**Mike** · 10-10-2006, 04:30 PM

How about we try to avoid turning this thread into a crap thread and stay on the topic at hand, and that is North Korea claiming to have successfully tested nuclear weapons.

This isn't about what the United States should be doing in Iraq, or if they should be there. This isn't a thread for you (D.J.) to come in here talking about Americans being brainwashed. It really isn't that hard to discuss a current event and discuss it maturely if you just try a little.

**Game Producer** · 10-11-2006, 02:57 AM

Sorry... I have to comment to the Iraq thingy - I do it real quick

Quote:

The Iraq war has been mismanaged and mistakes have been made. That does not negate the fact that the United States is the only one that stepped up and decided to do something about an unstable Iraq that had defied the world for 11 years. Did you ever think that if the rest of the world had provided more support that we would not see the struggles we see now?

Uh... Do you happen to know what country armed the Iraq/Saddam Hussein roughly a decade ago?

I personally think that US is a powerful country and great leader in the economics, but sometimes I don't agree the way US government handles thing. But - I suppose that can be said be said pretty much about any country. No offense meant for US (or any other countries/people/animals/plants...) in any way - just wanted to point that things aren't always that black & white. Thanks also for GeorgeB for good comments.

Quote:

North Korea claiming to have successfully tested nuclear weapons.

That's bad, but I think it's good to see that North Korea's friend/ally/what-you-call-it China seems to oppose this. China has said that those tests have done bad for the relationship between China and North Korea.

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-11-2006, 05:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Game Producer

Uh... Do you happen to know what country armed the Iraq/Saddam Hussein roughly a decade ago?

Uh yea

Yes I am well aware of who supported Iraq against Iran in the 80's. It's politics. You support who is going to help you at the time being. We did not want Iran to win. Iran winning would have been a terrible thing. Sometimes you just got to take a chance.

Quote:

Thanks also for GeorgeB for good comments.

No love for my comments

Quote:

That's bad, but I think it's good to see that North Korea's friend/ally/what-you-call-it China seems to oppose this. China has said that those tests have done bad for the relationship between China and North Korea.

We will see if they do anything. I predict they won't and will continue to be a problem in the long run.

**Game Producer** · 10-11-2006, 06:11 AM

I suppose they (and USA, Japan and suppose some other countries as well?) are going to use some sort of economical pressure and North Korea has informed that they are willing to talk.

And your comments are fine too - just wanted to point out that not everything is so black and white... and use of force and violence should not be the way to act first - economical pressure and negotiations can be used, for example.

**BamaStangGuy** · 10-11-2006, 01:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Game Producer

I suppose they (and USA, Japan and suppose some other countries as well?) are going to use some sort of economical pressure and North Korea has informed that they are willing to talk.

And your comments are fine too - just wanted to point out that not everything is so black and white... and use of force and violence should not be the way to act first - economical pressure and negotiations can be used, for example.

Maybe so but how many times have we tried diplomacy with countries like North Korea and it fail?

To many times

**Hobbit** · 10-11-2006, 10:52 PM

Our Gov. teacher scared us today and told us California would get nuked first if there's a war (I live in California). He also said the US might start drafting people, and that if we don't die from the bomb, we'll die from radiation. Is there even going to be a war? :|