"There's no such thing as a stupid question, but they're the easiest to answer!" TSG Liz

Dear All,

It appears that most of you have either not read or failed to appreciate the second post of mine in this thread.

I have apologised for my apparent arrogance (it was unintentional) and do so again without reservation. I am sorry for causing hurt or offence to Dee or to anyone else for that matter.

There has been mention of people making mistakes and not knowing everything. I covered this point in my previous post and do not profess to be all knowing - no-one can be.

In relation to making mistakes, clearly I am guilty of that in the way that I worded my initial response. The villification that has followed is somewhat disappointing and hurtful in itself, to me. I recognised the folly of my reply and made steps to put the matter right by saying sorry and posting a legitimate answer to the question initially posed. Whilst I don't expect this to gain me instant trust in the eyes of those who have been offended, I think I do deserve some credit for recognising my mistake and trying to put it right - everyone is applying a live and let live approach to all except me.

I do not know what more I can do to put this right, so maybe it's time to give me a break for the mistake I made, drawing a line under this whole sad episode and for us all to get on with helping each other.

Ian

PS - darkmirror - thank you for a taste of my own medicine, a sobering experience for me and a lesson learned on my part. I prefer to code in Notepad because, having tried DW, HMP and a host of others, it gives me the freedom to do what I want and I don't have to spend ages stripping unnecessary extraneous code from all my pages - it's not a macho stance it's just what works for me, especially as most of my web pages are written using php, and everyone will be different, I accept that.

Originally Posted by celticbrue

Dear All,

It appears that most of you have either not read or failed to appreciate the second post of mine in this thread.

I have apologised for my apparent arrogance (it was unintentional) and do so again without reservation. I am sorry for causing hurt or offence to Dee or to anyone else for that matter.

There has been mention of people making mistakes and not knowing everything. I covered this point in my previous post and do not profess to be all knowing - no-one can be.

In relation to making mistakes, clearly I am guilty of that in the way that I worded my initial response. The villification that has followed is somewhat disappointing and hurtful in itself, to me. I recognised the folly of my reply and made steps to put the matter right by saying sorry and posting a legitimate answer to the question initially posed. Whilst I don't expect this to gain me instant trust in the eyes of those who have been offended, I think I do deserve some credit for recognising my mistake and trying to put it right - everyone is applying a live and let live approach to all except me.

I do not know what more I can do to put this right, so maybe it's time to give me a break for the mistake I made, drawing a line under this whole sad episode and for us all to get on with helping each other.

Ian

PS - darkmirror - thank you for a taste of my own medicine, a sobering experience for me and a lesson learned on my part. I prefer to code in Notepad because, having tried DW, HMP and a host of others, it gives me the freedom to do what I want and I don't have to spend ages stripping unnecessary extraneous code from all my pages - it's not a macho stance it's just what works for me, especially as most of my web pages are written using php, and everyone will be different, I accept that.

Ian,
I did read your previous post and accepted the apology contained within. However, it wasn't apparent that you were wanting a reply. I agree that it's time to leave this topic now and get on with helping each other.
No hard feelings.

Just come across this again after the weekend of non-posting... it appears as if people have really missed my point.

I am in no way critisizimg Dee for not knowing about Doctype and setting up in web design. To be totally honest, I only learnt about it myself not too long ago. I was meerly stating my oppinions of the current state of the internet. I fully encourage any skilled person in taking up web design and setting up in business if they beleive they can. I am not, and have not commented on weather or not Dee should, having not seen any of his/her work. My comment applied to Ians comment about bungled design in general. Which is why I quoted that bit.

A really good example of this attitude is the way that Minaki has signed her post in a very large font with MCP in capital letters. "I have the right to criticise people, I've passed a Microsoft exam".

Could you please quote me where I've critisized someone?
Those letters are there to show my skills, one of the primary reasons I have them there is to give people an idea of who to ask for help when they have an MS related issue, a sort of 'advertising my services to the community' thing, not to give me any right or advantage over anyone else. It's in a large font because it's part of my name, which is in a larger font than the other bits. It's simple design, I'm not trying to show off. Please don't assume anything about me without talking to me.

I am a senior systems developer with ten years experience in Enterprise Software development. I have trained and mentored some highly proficient developers

So that gives YOU the right to make unfounded remarks about people based on a couple of lines post of their oppinion does it?

I wanted to look at your website, but it appears to be down at the moment. I'd be interested to know if you "hand code in notepad" too.

FYI, that site was done in Dreamweaver a while ago as an interim solution. I currently design my sites by hand in ASP.NET Web Matrix. You can see my current project that is still in early development stages at http://www.inoxia.co.uk/dotnet

Hi all,
Interesting thread I think. In my view it's only through supoorting and developing one another through discussion and information sharing that we can keep the web and software development culture dynamic.
This what keeps our skills and services in demand after all. As an example, I think the fantastic creativity and innovation of the open source movement is a testament to this, and one that I look to for inspiration all the time.
Look forward to reading your posts in the future.
Cheers,
Doug

While certainly this thread has been vigorous and passionate positions have been aired on all sides, it would better for all of us to avoid letting the tone degrade further.

Dee was able to get her question answered and that is a success. No one should ever be attacked for any question asked here. The fact that she was criticized for not knowing every obscure detail regarding DOCTYPEs while in the midst of starting a web design business was not at all desirable. Remember the name of the site, folks -- WEBMASTER TALK. Even web"masters" have questions. Even MCPs have questions and as Doug has stated and I concur, even career software professionals have questions. Not sometimes -- almost every single day.

The purpose of WT is to provide a forum where professionals, intermediates and even beginners can gather to talk about the topics that interest them and yes, to get answers to the questions that hound all of us.

At the end of the day, remember whose name goes at the bottom of all your posts...... And you are on notice: anything you post is being indexed somewhere by someone.

I'll leave the thread open for now, but let's keep it positive so it can stay that way.

(Doug, I always put my title in small font )