Suggestions and Feedback

**TG12** · 02-23-2010, 04:25 PM

Can anyone tell me why the majority of Forum Mods or "Masters" are so Anal about certain things especially this. I wanted to give away a few promotional codes for my iPhone app for the forum users to use at their leisure do as they please with but everywhere I ask I get abuse about how that is not allowed. I cant see why not . . . I'm guessing it might be taking up their resources and giving a chance at free advertising or is it that it might drive site traffic away from their site. I'm just curious to see if anyone else has come up against this. Its a very cut throat business I get that much and its hard to make something out of nothing . . . . Just a rant!

**NullPointer** · 06:37 PM

I'm not a mod but I think I can explain why they are so "anal".

First bullet in the rules:

Quote:

No Spamming

Spamming is characterized by the initiation of threads or posts that contribute nothing to a forum

I can't imagine what forum your post would contribute to if its sole purpose is to hand out promo codes. If given the freedom to do so, do you know how many people would just go around dropping links to whatever site/service they are promoting? I think you would find that the forum would quickly fill up with useless posts. Personally I wouldn't want to spend time on a forum where I have to sift through garbage to find something worth reading or discussing.

**Giselle** · 02-23-2010, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TG12

Hi I'm TG12. I came here because it was recommended as the largest forum. I am a Server Admin and have been for 2 years for a very large organisation. I came on here to look on how to optimize my sites for SEO.

Thanks :-)

Besides what all Matt mentioned, you just introduced yourself in the Introduction Forum and was interested in learning how to optimize your sites for SEO. Oh well......

**vangogh** · 02-24-2010, 01:53 AM

Matt and Giselle pretty much covered it. I just looked at your deleted post and it was deleted because it didn't comply with the forum rules. I take it by moderators being anal you mean having your post deleted because you hadn't reviewed other people's sites before asking for your own review. We ask you to do that for a reason. It's is part of the rules and you have to follow them.

You don't have to like the rules, but you still need to abide by them.

Besides it's not like there's anything to review on your site. It's pretty clear you posted just so you could get a link back to your site.

**TG12** · 06:25 AM

What I'm saying is that you can contribute to a forum for a long time, You know the frequent posters, the Most Valued Conrtibuters and then some Mods power goes to his head, Even if the link to your site is relevent to what the subject of the forum. I guess its a psychology thing. Im guessing its not much different from the outside world in terms of gangs encroaching on others turf so to speak . . . I am also willing to guess that the majority of posters on this forum are out to make money in this VERY competitive side of the internet and people get jelous and will try to stop others making money. . . Less money for you, More money for me attitude.
Dont get me wrong I like this forum even though I have been here less than two weeks but the same problems apply to whetever forum you post on, Its easy to assert your dominance online where there would be no backlash so to speak . . . Especially if your the Mod and can ban people. Judge me however you want. . . Im sure a lot of you already have.
And I didnt actually mean this forum originally I was asking the question generally I wont mention which ones that were in question.

**JeremyMiller** · 02-25-2010, 07:00 AM

You're attempting to follow an illogical path. Reminds me of the saying, "most of our so-called reasoning consists of finding excuses to go on believing as we already do."

You say "post to a forum for a long time" and then follow with "I have been here less than two weeks". You say "know the frequent posters" and yet are complaining about the actions of one who is not only a frequent poster, but a VERY HELPFUL one. You say "know...the most valued contributers" and yet accuse such a valued contributor of letting power go to his head.

And, from these contradictions, you attempt to conclude that his motivation is "less money for you and more money for me."

Let me let my own logic go to my head and attempt to help you, though you know the saying about leading a horse to water...

This forum is not here for the sole purpose of allowing you to create backlinks to your site. The section you were posting to is not there simply to allow you to advertise or ask for reviews without reviewing others -- even if they have already been reviewed by others. This forum is here to facilitate helping people to expand their knowledge of what they are doing in regards to web technologies -- sometimes to make money, but sometimes simply to put together a profitless website about a subject which they feel strongly about. You marched right on in, decided that the rules did not apply to you because you had a desire related to your own website, exempted yourself, and when someone reminded you of the rules, decided that they were in the wrong instead of simply taking a step back, realizing that your desire to "make money" did not trump the rules, and reviewing others' sites to help them make money -- i.e. follow the rules. More succinctly, you accused a moderator of doing what you were, in fact, doing -- focusing on "more money for me". It was OK, as far as your behavior indicates, for you to focus on your own profitability and all others be damned.

I'd recommend that you stop trying to rationalize your irrational behavior and apologize for failing to realize your error and attempt to contribute to the section in question before asking that others help you while you're not willing to help others. -- Think about it for a bit: Who would really want to help you when it's blatantly obvious that you will take without even trying to give -- or worse, find excuses why you can take and not try to give?

You did get a review, in truth: Not of your website, but of your demeanor. You didn't like that and attacked the messenger. What would your response be, one could ask, if you didn't like the review of your site?

**chrishirst** · 02-25-2010, 07:45 AM

You know, this sounds so much like most of the rants about the ODP (DMOZ) editors.

This,

Quote:

Hi, Since there were no other sites to Review (Any Replyless Threads). I thought I would kindly ask you to review my simple site. I have only just started it so any comments would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

is the deleted post that started this contretemps

and the review forum rules are

Now I understand that it was an issue of reading but NOT understanding fully what the rules actually state, we are all guilty of "skip reading" and maybe missing the pertinent points. However to paraphrase, "Ignorance of the rules is no defence". Hence the thread was deleted with a message of "Read the forum rules AGAIN!!" meaning, "read them properly this time".

**TG12** · 08:32 AM

See this is what I mean about forums people are getting heated about it for the wrong reasons. I wasnt having a go at this site at all . . . Anyway if you want delete this thread I wouldnt want people to get upset.

Edit - Yes I was guilty of "Skip Reading" Sorry. I fully understand everyones complaints and I am 100% In the wrong and I take full responsibility for any upset or hurt I may have caused anyone in particular. My logic was flawed. Simple We can all go back to our lives on forums in eternal bliss just how it was before I posted this thread. Sorry Guys/Girls!

**chrishirst** · 02-25-2010, 08:33 AM

Ah, Ok so you were having a rant here about somewhere else.

Some Dismal Part of the Internet perchance?

BTW Upset not specially, Defensive maybe (Like a Lioness with it's cubs

)

**TG12** · 02-25-2010, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Ah, Ok so you were having a rant here about somewhere else.

Yes Exactly. Thats why I asked if it had happened to anyone else . . .

Why highlight the D & P?

Yeah the defensiveness if part of Forum life . . .

**chrishirst** · 02-25-2010, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Why highlight the D & P?

Just in case it had some relevance to where you were ranting about.

(it's a bit of an "in" joke)

**JeremyMiller** · 02-25-2010, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TG12

Yes Exactly. Thats why I asked if it had happened to anyone else . . .

Why highlight the D & P?

Yeah the defensiveness if part of Forum life . . .

Maybe you posted in the wrong section, then, as this is the area for suggestions and feedback -- implicitly, that means for WT.

**vangogh** · 02-25-2010, 07:29 PM

James I understand what you're saying. I had thought you specifically meant WT when you started this thread. It is the Suggestions and Feedback forum and you did have a post deleted that seemed to fit with the cause of the rant, especially since your original post contains the following:

Quote:

I wanted to give away a few promotional codes for my iPhone app for the forum users to use at their leisure do as they please with but everywhere I ask I get abuse about how that is not allowed. I cant see why not

That does imply you were specifically talking about us.

I can only speak for myself when moderating a forum. I think many people fail to see sometimes how much work goes into moderating a forum. It's not easy and keep in mind most people doing so are volunteers. They're also human and like all humans have good and bad days.

You might be amazed at how much spam a forum like this gets. Most people only see what gets through and not what's canned right away. Some days a moderator might be quick to pull the trigger on deleting a post or thread, because they just spend an hour clearing out spam. I know I've done that before.

You also have to consider that since moderators are real people, some will be nice, some will be jerks, some will be (fill in any description of a human being you want). Odds are the % breakdown will be similar to what you find in the general population or at least in the typical population that makes up the market for the forum.

You can take it a little further and realize that it takes a certain kind of person to be good at finding and removing spam, moderating disputes between forum members, etc. Once you've narrowed it down are mods more likely to be anal? Maybe. I really don't know. My own experience is they've been a mix of people like you'll find in any other group of people on the planet

**TG12** · 02-26-2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremyMiller

Maybe you posted in the wrong section, then, as this is the area for suggestions and feedback -- implicitly, that means for WT.

It actually got moved here!

Yeah I can understand where your comming from vangogh

**Mystical Pippin** · 03-28-2010, 01:18 PM

As always Steve, you eloquently hit the nail on the head. I must say when I first started reading TG12's posts here I was thinking along the same lines as Jeremy.

I give TG12 some credit for being persistant and finally clearing up his intentions.

In the past, I've been a member of a few sites that had poor monitoring or NO moderators, administrators, etc.. the SPAM does get out of control and that's saying it mildly. What usually happens is the members become so frustrated and tired of asking for the removal of them that they just stop coming. Eventually, someone will come along and delete them but of course it goes right back to being out of control.

Think of it as reading a say... an online newspaper with stories about controversial subjects or opposing views like the Huffington Post or Washington Post or NY Times. And after reading the story you want to comment on it. But when you scroll down to the posts you see about 6-8 posts between each REAL post - like: "I just met my husband on millionare.com" causing extra pages and then you can't even comment on someone elses comments because there is too much junk in between. It's enough to make one go postal. Now of course this doesn't happen on those sites but imagine if it did. It does make people angry and for good reason.

I do think TG12 was just not understanding that posting his free promo codes - was still spam.

Kind of naive for his line of work, but never the less to paraphrase Chris: Ignorance of the rules..... it's like Ignorance of the law.....the police are not going to let you do it because you didn't know...

And Chris without you being the "Lioness" we'd all be defenseless cubs running around here never finding answers or getting drowned by spamanators!

**vangogh** · 03-29-2010, 08:25 PM

Thanks Joni. We do try to moderate what we can. On my small business forum I'm the owner so I get to set the policy on what is and isn't considered spam. Spammers are banned quickly and we clean out the useless posts. Lead to a very high signal to noise ratio.