PageRank Technology: PageRank reflects our view of the importance of web pages by considering more than 500 million variables and 2 billion terms. Pages that we believe are important pages receive a higher PageRank and are more likely to appear at the top of the search results.

Quote taken from: http://www.google.com/corporate/tech.html

To me, that pagerank description tells me that PR DOES in fact matter, it comes straight from Google.

Now, I realize PR is only one of many, many factors in helping a site/page rank well for keywords (title tags, headings, keyword placement, and to me most important relevant content). But, it says right there on googles site that pages that we believe are important pages receive a higher PageRank and are more likely to appear at the top of the search results.

Am I missing something, or does that mean PR has a value to your site.

And I don't give a rats dookie whether or not I am able to see true PR in whatever toolbar I use (seoquake and alexa with firefox), what I am asking here is why do so many in this forum discount PR, when it appears to me that it really does matter in Googles eyes?

PS: I am NOT a coder, I design and optimize my wordpress sites for my own benefit and am here to learn and try to contribute to conversations that I am passionate about.

PR is one of the important factor when you going to build links to your site but some people always worry about the PR of their site more than their search engine ranking and that is a bad Idea. they should focus on getiing higher ranking on search engines and not on PR.

I agree Alex, but by the comments in that article on Google, it appears to me one is actually directly related to the other.

PR comes when site have own value, so you dont have to worry about it when you are active in SEO

When Google talk about PageRank they are refering to REAL PR which only they can see the actual value of.

What every body prattles on about is Toolbar PR, the out of date, inaccurate, integer representation that is exported occasionally for the masses to worship.

Correct me if I am wrong Chris, are you saying that PageRank is completely invisible to all of us and there is no way to know the true value that Google gives a site?

Another question would be, what/who determines that the PR I see in my Firefox addons is inaccurate?

PR doesn't matter if you are after SERP rankings which is the most important. The importance of having your link on high PR website is they can give you they so called link juice that will help to increase also your PR on the next Google PR update.

Originally Posted by benedict65

PR doesn't matter if you are after SERP rankings which is the most important. The importance of having your link on high PR website is they can give you they so called link juice that will help to increase also your PR on the next Google PR update.

Did you read the google page: pages that we believe are important pages receive a higher PageRank and are more likely to appear at the top of the search results.

It appears to me that PR has a direct affect to the SERPs. I realize that some sites outrank higher PR sites in the SERP's, but I think if you are after a really competitive one or two word keyword, PR matters (real PR not toolbar PR).

Originally Posted by FenceGuy

Correct me if I am wrong Chris, are you saying that PageRank is completely invisible to all of us and there is no way to know the true value that Google gives a site?

Another question would be, what/who determines that the PR I see in my Firefox addons is inaccurate?

That's correct there is no way to know what the actual value is.

And PR being a Bernoulli distribution (probability) the total value for ALL pages is 1 as any statistics student could tell you.
(or you can read it at http://infolab.stanford.edu/~backrub/google.html )

So it's not much of a leap to realise that an integer representation of a real number that is > 1 is not going to be "accurate", and a value of 3 could be representative of 2.499999999999999999999999999 to 3.499999999999999999999999999

therefore a change as miniscule as 0.0000000000000000001 could be the difference between showing as PR2 or showing as PR3.

Thanks for the clarification on that Chris, I am still not convinced that (true) PR doesn't directly help you in the SERP's but your explanation helps tremendously in understanding what/how PR may work.

I still have much to learn, but that is why I joined this forum (so I can hopefully learn how to blow my competition away over the next yr or two! LOL)

Originally Posted by FenceGuy

... I am still not convinced that (true) PR doesn't directly help you in the SERP's...

Who is trying to convince you of that?

Originally Posted by bigstatsnet

PR comes when site have own value, so you dont have to worry about it when you are active in SEO

I agree! I pretty much ignore PR. In fact I ignore 99.99% of link exchange requests as I prefer page 1 SERPS for search terms I am targeting and would prefer to just pretty much leave linking to natural linking others can do if they wish.

However I am not averse to linking to others if thet are totally, and I men totally relevant, and are therfor helping improve the end user experience.

I am not afraid to link to the best competitors for a search term. Heck if they end user does not want what I have, they are welcome to find the easiest route to the best alternative imho.

I am not afraid to link to the best competitors for a search term. Heck if they end user does not want what I have, they are welcome to find the easiest route to the best alternative imho.

Putting real users first! Whoo! Hoo!

Sadly you are a dying breed though, in a world where SEs get priority and scratching for adsense peanuts has become the driving force.

I understand putting real users first (well after me!) but man, I don't know if I could link to my competitors. I want the user to find the product they are looking for, and I could see linking to someone that carried a product that I don't have in the same niche, as long as they don't carry the same products as me (unless they are much higher priced).

Very bold. And again, I do understand making the user 1st (was kidding about me) but I don't know if I could link to a direct competitor. Tough one, for sure. Something I will have to ponder.

Originally Posted by FenceGuy

I understand putting real users first (well after me!) but man, I don't know if I could link to my competitors. I want the user to find the product they are looking for, and I could see linking to someone that carried a product that I don't have in the same niche, as long as they don't carry the same products as me (unless they are much higher priced).

Very bold. And again, I do understand making the user 1st (was kidding about me) but I don't know if I could link to a direct competitor. Tough one, for sure. Something I will have to ponder.

Well consider this as an example and the reasoning why it is a pretty good idea not to be afraid to link to competitors

Lets say somene is searching for aluminium or vynyl fences but they are in the UK, Australia, Germany, Canada, France, Holland or wherever, are they going to buy from you if you are in the US?

The answer is probably not. Yet some of those Countries use English as their fist language and SE's like Google have a habit of serving up websites on page 1 which are geographically miles apart.

A goog technique and recipricol linking strategy (perhaps imho the best "non natural linking strategy) is to do exactly what Google etc ask you to do.

Which is provide only relevant links. Relevant links count for more any way so you are helpig yourself whilst also helping the likes of Google "when decent geo relevant anchor texts are used as you are in turn helping the end user.

What are the chances you will lose a customer if someone clicks on a "UK aluminium Fences" anchor text link on your site?

I would say very low.

You simply ask the UK Company you backlink with to reciprocate in the same manner for your geo location.

What are the chances that UK Company will lose a customer to a US visitor?

Not much I would say as they are likely going to go back to Google and lookfor a US based supplier once they find they are on a UK based site.

Why not just exchange links with your so called "Competors" in this geographical way?

Another way is to link to those who supply complimentary products you do not stock. This way you do not even need to worry about the Geo thing.

If you supply fences, link to a local "turf" supplier if you have no intention of stocking turf, for example. The local turf supplier might also see the relevance to and if they don't stock fencing they will likely be just as happy to link back to.

You gain extra Geo words on site doing this to, and I don't think that can be a bad thing. By that I mean specific to your own locale.

Competitors in the same market are not always competitors as such on the net, as with physical objects it is more likely someone will use a local service than one many many miles away.

You would probably find if you we're in Florida or California you would be pretty safe not to lose business by linking to a direct competitor in say Chicago or New York or Maine as they are likely to use a local company.

You may even find the opposite happens and as a California Fence Company you "could" pick up a customer from New York because you got found for someone doing a New York Geo search for fences and the only reason they fiind you at all is because of the Geo backlink.

Great post, thanks for sharing it for the rest of us.

hi,

PR doesn't matter if you are after SERP rankings which is the most important.

Originally Posted by onlinegame123

hi,

PR doesn't matter if you are after SERP rankings which is the most important.

Did you read the article I quoted in the beginning or did you just answer to get a quick link? Try reading the quoted article from Google, it clearly states what I was talking about, I consider that and authority.

Originally Posted by MrFlicks

Well consider this as an example and the reasoning why it is a pretty good idea not to be afraid to link to competitors

Lets say somene is searching for aluminium or vynyl fences but they are in the UK, Australia, Germany, Canada, France, Holland or wherever, are they going to buy from you if you are in the US?

The answer is probably not. Yet some of those Countries use English as their fist language and SE's like Google have a habit of serving up websites on page 1 which are geographically miles apart.

A goog technique and recipricol linking strategy (perhaps imho the best "non natural linking strategy) is to do exactly what Google etc ask you to do.

Which is provide only relevant links. Relevant links count for more any way so you are helpig yourself whilst also helping the likes of Google "when decent geo relevant anchor texts are used as you are in turn helping the end user.

What are the chances you will lose a customer if someone clicks on a "UK aluminium Fences" anchor text link on your site?

I would say very low.

You simply ask the UK Company you backlink with to reciprocate in the same manner for your geo location.

What are the chances that UK Company will lose a customer to a US visitor?

Not much I would say as they are likely going to go back to Google and lookfor a US based supplier once they find they are on a UK based site.

Why not just exchange links with your so called "Competors" in this geographical way?

Another way is to link to those who supply complimentary products you do not stock. This way you do not even need to worry about the Geo thing.

If you supply fences, link to a local "turf" supplier if you have no intention of stocking turf, for example. The local turf supplier might also see the relevance to and if they don't stock fencing they will likely be just as happy to link back to.

You gain extra Geo words on site doing this to, and I don't think that can be a bad thing. By that I mean specific to your own locale.

Competitors in the same market are not always competitors as such on the net, as with physical objects it is more likely someone will use a local service than one many many miles away.

You would probably find if you we're in Florida or California you would be pretty safe not to lose business by linking to a direct competitor in say Chicago or New York or Maine as they are likely to use a local company.

You may even find the opposite happens and as a California Fence Company you "could" pick up a customer from New York because you got found for someone doing a New York Geo search for fences and the only reason they fiind you at all is because of the Geo backlink.

Those are great ideas that I hadn't thought of, thanks. I did, however, say that I would be skeptical to link to "direct" competitors, meaning a competitor that carries the same type of products and ships to the same area. There are some ideas that I agree with in your statement. I would be happy to link to an online supplier in another country, or one that carried a product that I don't. The hard part about linking to someone that carries a product that I don't have (here in USA) is that chances are they also carry aluminum and vinyl, which I also have.

I really like the idea of linking out to suppliers in other countries though! Thanks a bunch for that idea, will start working on a strategy for that this weekend!

PR depends on links you have for your site. normally if you work good for SEO, Traffic & Updated content at your site. You dont need to worry about links and PRs. visitor will autometicaly increase your link by sharing your usefull content and links as well.