Originally Posted by aboyd

That's interesting, but that's not the sandbox.

So what IS the sandbox effect by your definition? I always understood it as google penalising 'young' sites by putting an age factor into its algorithm.

Maybe we need a coherent definition if we're all talking cross-purposes...

These are a two definitions I have found:

"The penalty or devaluation in the Google SERPs of sites with SEO efforts begun after xxxx" SEOmoz.org

"The Google Sandbox is a metaphorical term to explain why most new websites have very poor rankings in Google " Search Engine journal

Hope this helps!

Sorry, I should have quoted the part of your post I was responding to. I'll edit the post to make it more clear (and more friendly, as it sounded snotty at first, but I was just rushing). I think your definition of the sandbox is correct.

Originally Posted by aboyd

There is a tool here to test the sandbox:

http://roberttaft.com/no_filter.htm

I tried it for "publisher database" (my site) and in a normal search, my site doesn't even rank. But in the "no sandbox" search, my site is #1.

Personally, I obviously really, really want to get out of the sandbox.

-Tony

Hello Tony

How has he defined the sandbox. just adding some words that are ignored by google and adding them gives you results that dont include the sandbox theory. How can that be logically related. Can you point me to somewhere which explains that.

Thanks
Shabbir Bhimani

Originally Posted by shabbirbhimani

just adding some words that are ignored by google and adding them gives you results that dont include the sandbox theory. How can that be logically related. Can you point me to somewhere which explains that.

The page I linked to explained it sufficiently, so if that didn't do it for you, I can't help you out. In particular, all I needed to read was one sentence, and then I understood the sandbox effect: "By providing enough words, Google will provide results from more indexed pages than a regular search."

So Google has a big pile of results, but it sits on a bunch of them and doesn't show them in a normal search. That's a sandbox.

Originally Posted by aboyd

The page I linked to explained it sufficiently, so if that didn't do it for you, I can't help you out. In particular, all I needed to read was one sentence, and then I understood the sandbox effect: "By providing enough words, Google will provide results from more indexed pages than a regular search."

If that the case lets analyze it

If we search for web hosting we get on top is fortunecity

"When we search for web hosting at a for the in with on to by as "
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/webhosting/

and when we search for
"web hosting at a for the in with on to by as web hosting at a for the in with on to by as web hosting at a for the in with on to by as web hosting at a for the in with on to by as"
As suggested by your link it says without Sandbox

We get something else. So what is the gurantee that putting that many unnecessary words can only get us the sandbox effect removed.

Also If we consider one more thing

when we search for web hosting we also get the site that comes first as suggested by the above Sandbox site and what can we infer on this.

Originally Posted by shabbirbhimani

So what is the gurantee that putting that many unnecessary words can only get us the sandbox effect removed.

It seems like that question is best directed at Google, although you and I both know that Google isn't going to give us hints about their ranking system. Second best person to ask would be the person who wrote that tool. I'm really no more qualified to answer your question than anybody else. In a pinch, I would say that nothing there is a guarantee, but I've made conclusions anyway. My personal conclusion is: there is a sandbox, my site is in it, and when it comes out of the sandbox, my site will be listed as #1. I do not expect that I will slug my way to the top, starting at #500, then #250, then #100, etc. I believe that because the sandbox tool shows I'm already at #1 for my search terms, but only when the sandbox is removed.

If it turns out that my conclusions are wrong, then I'll adapt.

Originally Posted by shabbirbhimani

when we search for web hosting we also get the site that comes first as suggested by the above Sandbox site and what can we infer on this.

Nothing. Or at least, I would infer nothing. My impression is that it isn't binary for sites that are out of the sandbox -- if you're out of the sandbox, you'll appear in both the normal search and the sandbox-removed search. So a site that appears in both is just doing as expected.

The interesting thing is to go through ALL the results of a normal search, compare that to the results of a sandbox-removed search, and see what sites are completely omitted from the normal search. Then, see what they have in common. So far, anecdotal evidence (my own site being a case in point) suggests that all the omitted sites are very new. However, I wouldn't be surprised to find other things, too. Maybe blacklisted sites, for example.

Originally Posted by shabbirbhimani

So all the votes are in favor that there is snadbox but actually there is nothing called sandbox.

Well, to me is when there is no sandbox theory, Google SERP can be manipulated easily by having a massive amount of back links from different GeoIPs. Coz, in order to measure and using PR in effective way "displaying relevency in SERP", Google does use geographic IPs around the world as one of their PR algorithm.

I dont' think Google ranks new content better. However, adding new pages to your site will increase the frequency of visits by Googlebots.