I dont know if there's many other designers out there that feel the same way but...

...when you have an amazing idea, and actually create it [or start to create it] and then your client asks you to change it in a really drastic way, that would ruin what you intended. Do you ever feel really hesitant to change it the way they want?

Sometimes doing what they advise actually turns out for the better, but from most of my experiences Ive always found most clients [which isn't THAT many just yet] want me to use really BAD ideas.

I know they are the boss, since they're the ones paying for it, but I find it really hard to understand why some of them want me to alter the work in such an ugly way...

They do say that beauty is in the eye of the beholder - and that is completely true. And yes it is the client that pays the bills - if you really hate it don't add your name to it - but that brings up SEO and business issues.

Grin and bear it - thats life. No matter who you work with you are always going to get someone like that. Everyone has to deal with that type of client all the time. Your job, like everyone elses is to give the client what they want. You need to learn to adapt to people tastes, for instance, you may absolutly hate the style my site is, but i'm quite fond of that style, so you if were my web designer, and you never gave me a style of site like that, then i would tell you to change thing to make it what i like which you might think is "ugly".

Really they are not interfering, but telling you what they want.

I hate to say it but "deal with it" (as tracy says in the BB uk house)

I understand how you feel, but it's one of those things that's going to happen. Ideally you can build up your business to the point where your clients need you a lot more than you need them and you can pick and choose who you work with. Even then this will happen.

Here's a trick that sometimes works, though not always. Say a client asks for a specific color (red) in a heading and you know it's not a good choice for the design. Explain why you think it's not a good choice. Do what you can to make them understand why. Clients are often more reasonable than you think and explaining your point of view can go a long way. Some will still insist on seeing their color.

Find the worst possible red you can and use that. Invariably your original choice will look better and the client will drop the request. Ideally your poor choice of red will reaffirm your explanation of why their color wasn't a good choice.

Of course you do run the risk of them liking what you think is a really bad color. In that case just do it like the client wants and don't add the site to your portfolio.

I got your point mate.. but they are clients and you should do what they want. Take note that they are the ones who give the task and you're only the one who makes it.. Just follow them and don't insist of what you like for it's not for you, it's for them. You can give suggestions and let them try to think of it before you make revisions.

Steven's on to something. When I know an idea is bad, I'll explain it...if they want to see it, I'll show it to them, both their way and mine. That way, they can pick between the two...quite often they need to see them side by side.

Aadriyah, I'm not saying I won't do what clients want. Believe me I've done a lot of things on clients sites that I think were awful, but it's what the client wanted. You won't ever see me showing that work off, but I've done it.

I think it's important to explain why you're choosing to do things a certain way though. Part of what a client is hiring you for is your expertise as a designer. You would be doing them a disservice if you didn't at least try to convince them of your point of view.

I also listen to my clients and their reasons for wanting something a certain way. Sometimes they're right. They know their business better than I do and often they have very good reasons for wanting something a certain way. I think it's important to have an open discussion about many things while designing.

In the end it's their site and their decision. I'm not trying to say otherwise. What I suggested above isn't always appropriate, but sometimes it is and it does work. As a designer I do think my job is to give my clients the best site I can. There are times where just because the client's grandmother likes red it doesn't mean red should be part of the color scheme.

Did anyone ever stop to think, that we (some of us at least) are the professionals here? Why in God's name would you just do what a client wants you to? That's no different than you offering legal advice to your attorney when you are facing prison time, telling him/her what the best strategy is when he/she is in front of a judge that's debating your 20 to life sentence; it's just plain stoopid!

Now I realize that my analogy here is a stretch by comparison, but you get the point. Simply remind your clients that this website isn't so much about their personal tastes as much as it is about what will get their clients to stay on the website. I can only assume that when we are saying "this [insert the client's bad idea here] is a bad design idea", it's because we are cognizant of the fact that that particular design idea simply isn't going to work.

Always accepting what the client wants will defeat the purpose of what we are trying to do for the client; create a design that will attract AND KEEP potential clients at that website to increase their business. If a client chooses a bad design idea and we knowingly move forward with that bad design idea, not only are we hurting our own reputations, we are doing our clients a disservice! Simply leaving your tag off the finished will not keep others from figuring out who you are.

You need to study different aspects of design to give a knowledgeable and precise reason a design idea doesn't work. Don't base it on your opinion. Doing that is no different than what your client is doing. You may not like the idea, but if it doesn't degrade the integrity of the site's design, use it! However, if the client's idea isn't going to enhance the site's design, you as a designer need to explain why so the client has a clear understanding and offer a well educated alternative to keep them satisfied and to keep the design moving on the right track.

Sorry so long, but I had a lot to say about this. I went through this very thing with one of my current clients. Stand your ground folks (when necessary) it will pay off in the long run!

I think there's a balance. I completely agree that we are the professionals and the client comes to us in part for our experience. I will fight for what I think is right, but there is a big difference between web design and legal advice.

The client does have a right to the site they want. That doesn't mean I'll do anything for them. There are points where I know it's not going to work out and I'll suggest we part ways.

Most of the time I'll do what I can to convince the client why I think my ideas are best to meet their goals and I do have a few tricks here or there to get them to see my point of view. But again it's their site. They have every right to do what they want with it and in the end I will do what I can to give my clients the site they want, not the one I want.

I clearly stated that my analogy was a stretch. I had just finished listening to American Justice, sorry.

I think there is a misunderstanding to what I was saying. I'm not talking about doing the website the way "I want" it. I'm talking about doing a website the way it "should be" done.

If a client were able to do the site themselves, why on Earth would they hire us in the first place? I'm not talking about bulldogging a client into something because it's "my way or the highway". I am simply pointing out that if you are hired for a job (as a professional) then it's your responsibility to ensure that the site is going to be designed properly. Basically it boils down to this phrase: Just because someone is paying you, doesn't mean they have to be right all the time. The old moniker of: "The customer is always right" would lead the visual aspects of the internet in a lot worse shape than it already is.

Choosing the right color, image, content location, etc, etc is what sets the big dogs apart from the puppies. Disregarding logical design because the client simply wants something different could pan out to be bad news for any designer.

In the case of my clients, I simply explain this to them before hand. That way when we come to a bump in the road (like my current client) I can simply remind them of that and continue to move on. Otherwise I will be spending all of my work time trying to explain why I am doing this (or that) and not getting my project completed on time....just my thoughts here

No need to apologize. I did see you mentioning the stretch in the analogy. I do understand what you're saying and I agree in general.

I'm always going to fight clients when it comes to doing things I know are going to be bad. I won't design a splash page no matter how much someone wants it.

Usually I've been able to explain myself and clients will listen and agree. Sometimes they won't. I have had clients suggest colors that when I tried them were better than what I originally suggested. More often the case was the opposite, but it happens.

I think as designers we need to accept a couple of things. One is that we're not always right. And the other is that in the end the sites we're designing for clients aren't our sites. I absolutely agree we were hired for a job and I think our skill and experience is part of that job.

But in the end it's their site and if they insist on something I'll most of the time do it their way. I'll remind them time and again that I disagree with the choice, but they have the right to do what they want good or bad.

I think we actually agree on everything, but maybe have different ways for dealing with clients who are suggesting things we strongly think they shouldn't do. And my guess is we're probably pretty close about how we do that too.